[cjprius]

I read today that owners of some 2004 and 2005 Prius cars have reported that the car shut down while driving. The car had to be towed to the dealer for repair.

According to the article, Toyota spokesman Sam Butto said the automaker identified a programming error in the computer systems of 23,900 Prius cars last year. He said that last May (2004) Toyota sent owners of those cars service warnings telling them to go to their dealerships for a software upgrade.

Does anyone have a copy of the letter Toyota sent to the customers?

Thanks...

 

[DanMan32]

You are referring to ssc-40D, and that was mainly to have the diagnostic codes compatable with industry standards.

There have been a few recalibration bulletins, but not recalls. Most can restart the car after a few tries and drive to the dealer to get the update. Some haven't gotten the update after getting it restarted and the problem never resurfaced.
Kyle indicated there is another calibration code coming out that is already in new ECMs, but hasn't been posted on Techinfo. Toyota tries to balance and find tune gas mileage with low emissions, and sometimes that causes the engine to start just a tad late.

 

[mikepaul]

So, has the 'software glitch' mentioned (can't get to PriusChat for the full story link) actually been tracked down and fixed?

I'm willing to trek to the dealer again to avoid being towed...

Ah. Here we go, from another post here: http://tinyurl.com/9gkvs

I'm guessing they just have a name for the problem and not a ready solution...

 

[evander]

I read the Wall Street article which is a bit of a jolt to 2004 Prius owners. Luckily mine is a recent model. But why is the article only coming out now? Did this computer software glitch occur only after a few months driving, or is it only now that Toyota is admitting the problem? That wasn't addressed.

 

[PriusownerCAL]

How will you know if you car has that software problem and is there a way to check.

I did not receive a notice from Toyota. I got my car April 23rd but the manufactor date might be different.

 

[mrv]

article here

http://www.priusonline.com/viewtopic.php?t=4916

http://online.wsj.com/article_email/0,, ... m4,00.html

which seems to have been picked up elsewhere... http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/16/Autos/p ... /index.htm

 

[mrv]

if you are concerned, get your VIN and call Toyota and ask if it is covered in the SSC.
1-800-GO-TOYOTA (1-800-46869682)
or as found in the latest SSC owner notifications:
Toyota Customer Experience Center:
1–888–270–9371 Monday through Friday, 5:00 am to 9:30 pm, Saturday and Sunday 7:00 am through 3:00 pm Pacific
Standard Time.

SSC-40A was the first reprogramming for the 2004+ Prius (which superceded/obsoleted a TSB). SSC-40A has since been superceded by SSC-40D, which I'm attaching the owner notification letter. According to the SSC-40D dealer notification:

Identification of Involved Vehicles
Nationally, there are approximately 23,800 Model Year 2004 Prius vehicles involved in this special service campaign.
YEAR MODEL VIN Range VDS Range
2004 Prius KB20U 40001086 – 40053733
2004 Prius KB22U 40001142 – 40053728
NOTE: Not all vehicles in the VIN ranges are involved in this SSC. Always consult Dealer Daily or TIS to confirm VIN eligibility and to assure the SSC is applicable. This will verify the vehicle is involved and has not already been completed by another dealer or prior to dealer delivery. TMS warranty will not reimburse dealers for repairs conducted on vehicles that are not affected.

However, there is currently another TSB out that supercedes the SSC-40D programming, for a similar engine stalling condition (you run on battery only until you pull over...)... (TSBs are only performed if your car is exhibiting a certain problem - it's not a proactive mailing like a SSC.)
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/toy ... 047-04.zip or http://www.alldata.com/tsb/Toyota/10980 ... index.html
US TSB EG047-04
Feb. 22, 2005 revision of Oct. 18, 2004, M.I.L. "ON" DTC P3191, P3190, AND/OR P0A0F, 2004-2005 Prius. Replaces TSB EG027-04. (engine does not restart - reprogram the Engine and HV Hybrid ECU after performing the SSC 40D reprogramming.)

 

[KTPhil]

Seeing as how this is old news, I rather suspect some news planting by, ahem, those who do not yet make a competitor to the Prius.

 

[tstreet]

However, there is currently another TSB out that supercedes the SSC-40D programming, for a similar engine stalling condition (you run on battery only until you pull over...)... (TSBs are only performed if your car is exhibiting a certain problem - it's not a proactive mailing like a SSC.)

Isn't this problem serious enough to merit a so called proactive mailing? If this happens in the middle of Wyoming, for example, it would be inconvenient to say the least.

Nothing in the SSC-40d would have led the recipient to believe that there was a serious problem. There is nothing in the letter that informs the owner that their car's ICE may shut down in the middle of a highway. Or, am I missing the intent of SSC-40d?

Admittedly, a prudent owner would always go to Toyota for the required reprogramming. But it seems as though Toyota should be more clear as to the possible dangers ineherent in not getting the reprogramming.

Regarding the new TSB. Is it applicable to both the 2004 and 2005 models. SSC-40d was applicable to 2004 models.

Assuming that 2005 models had the reprogramming prior to release, is there some additional programming applicable to 2005? I guess the TSB you mentioned would take care of this.

FWIW, there is just one 2005 model listed with the stalling prolblem in the NHTSA database, Here it is.

[quote:2tdkmgc6]I WAS DRIVING MY 2005 TOYOTA PRIUS AT ABOUT 45 MPH WHEN THE VEHICLE WENT DEAD. THE BATTERY CHARGE INDICATOR WENT TO ZERO, THE ENGINE WARNING LIGHT CAME ON, THE MASTER WARNING LIGHT CAME ON, THE VEHICLE STABILITY CONTROL WARNING LIGHT CAME ON. I PULLED TO THE SIDE OF THE ROAD. AT FIRST THE VEHICLE WOULD NOT SHUT OFF. AFTER SEVERAL ATTEMPTS THE VEHICLE SHUT DOWN. I RESTARTED THE VEHICLE, AND WITH THE ENGINE SERVICE LIGHT ON WAS ABLE TO GET IT FIRST HOME, THEN TO A TOYOTA DEALER. THE DEALER SAID THE VEHICLE NEEDED AN "UPGRADE" TO ITS SOFTWARE AND REPROGRAMMED THE ECU. ( AT NO CHARGE TO ME AS THE VEHICLE IS STILL UNDER WARRANTY). IF AN UPGRADE WAS AVAILABLE AND REQUIRED, I FEEL I SHOULD HAVE BEEN NOTIFIED SO THAT I AND MY WIFE WERE NOT PUT AT RISK. *NM

[/quote:2tdkmgc6]

 

[mrv]

I completely forgot about SSC-40E. That would lead to a stalling condition. SSC-40E put some weatherstripping under the hood, to keep water from entering the engine compartment and stalling the engine...

[edit: added the owner notification letter for LSC-40E]

 

[hyperion]

You don't exactly get a letter. Just a notice that your car has to be returned to the dealer as soon as possible for computer reprograming. (I believe that's what mine said) They keep the note and as stated I was at dealership less than an hour. I could not find from the service manager what exactly the reprograming would accomplish.

 

[cjprius]

Another name for a recall

Seems to me that

"sending customers a service warning telling them to go to their dealer for a software upgrade"

is just a different way of announcing a customer satisfaction recall. Sending the customers a letter telling them to take the car back to the dealer for a repair is a recall, but it sure doesn't sound like it the way Toyota worded it.

Pretty smooth...

 

[hyperion]

I almost forgot the one "recall" that I received which was explained, and it was in the form of a warning that my brake light switch had to be replaced immediately as it had the potential to fail and not give any brake light indication. That took about twenty minutes and was a small dollar item "eaten" by Toyota and just time enough for me to have coffee and a doughnut! Of course it is a fifteen mile drive to the dealer and it is down the street from a large shopping mall where I have to drop my wife and each trip costs me a small fortune and my grandaughters get new clothes.

 

[longrun]

prius Crashing cont...

Hello again,
Have written in a couple of times and we have had this problem many times - where the car "crashes" - all warning lights come on, limp along in electric only, etc... the car will restart if you let it sit for about 5 minutes. Toyota had our car for almost a week and couldn't reproduce the problem, so in their minds - there is no problem. :x
Am wondering if this latest article in the WSJ and elsewhere is a futher sign that a lot of people are having this problem with no resolution. We now have every software update available for the 2004 model and it "crashed" 2 days after the latest update! So, that did not fix it...
Kyle has given us some clues to check out, but the dealer took a look at those areas and said everything was "just fine"...
We drive the vehicle very cautiously now and are contstantly worried that it's going to "crash" when we need to accelerate and we'll get run down in traffic - again, this is not acceptable - but have gotten no help from our local dealers to date.
Thanks for posting the article - I'm going to file a complaint with the NHTSA, maybe they will launch a formal investigation and force Toyota to really deal with this major issue. If anyone else would like to file a complaint - here is the link: http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/index.cfm

 

[KTPhil]

"a lot of people are having this problem with no resolution"

9 out of 100,000 isn't a lot (13 includes duplicates). But Toyota should be working harder to investigate, and then publicize to owners. To find out a potential problem was known by a dealer but to not hear about it to prevent it is just plain bad policy.

 

[longrun]

9 out of 100,000 isn't a lot (13 includes duplicates). But Toyota should be working harder to investigate, and then publicize to owners. To find out a potential problem was known by a dealer but to not hear about it to prevent it is just plain bad policy.

That's only 9 that actually complained to the NHTSA, I didn't know that you could even file a complaint with them until this morning... Have been on this forum, along with Prius Chat and the hybridcars.com site and there are many others in several different categories (not really sure what to call it - have to search the descriptions) so I know there are far more than 9 people having this issue.

If and when it happens to you - you will realize how serious and shocking it is to have your car "die" in the midst of rush hour traffic with an H2 (or equivalent oversized SUV) riding your butt and amost climbing into your back seat :shock:

The fact is - Toyota does know about this issue, they know that the last software update did not solve the problem - and they currently have no solution - or are waiting until X# of people are seriously hurt or killed in accidents to do something about it.

Waayyyyyy unacceptable in my book.

 

[KTPhil]

"The fact is - Toyota does know about this issue, they know that the last software update did not solve the problem - and they currently have no solution - or are waiting until X# of people are seriously hurt or killed in accidents to do something about it."

Please post proof of this assertion.

Unless you have insider information, you are engaging in libelous speculation. Perhaps you like being the breaker of astonishing news. I suggest you limit your contributions to the National Enquirer, the Star, and other speculative sensationalist media. Making up phoney insider information in a post is out of line.

 

[dgstan]

longrun,

I'm not sure a complaint to the NHTSA is the way for you to go. If I was you, I'd be looking into the Lemon Law in your state. You might have gotten a bad one.
If Toyota's TSB didn't fix it, it's probably something else. If they can't fix it after several tries, the laws (I believe) are pretty clear.


DGStan

 

[DanMan32]

Actually, if there is a TSB relating to this problem whose corrective solution is a reprogram, I have to agree, Toyota obviously knows, after all they wrote the TSB. Programming isn't a part that breaks, so all cars without the latest programming should get it. The consequences of the problem, as few as they are, are at least nerve wracking if not POTENTIALLY dangerous, so it is something that should recieve greater attention.
At least the car doesn't go completely dead, you still have at least a 1/2 mile drive to pull over before the car completely quits. Even when it does completely quit, you still have power steering and brakes since they are electric and do not requre the ICE to operate.

Some dealers will do the TSB as a preventive action.

 

[tstreet]

If the dealer is saying there is no problem, then that's just totally rephrehensible. This isn't just a minor defect; this is a potentially life threatening problem. Have you tried calling Toyota HQ? In any event, maybe you can get some action through the NHTSA. In any event, good luck. I hope I am not treated this way if I have a problem.