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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am tired of reading articles claiming that "you pay more for the hybrid technology than you save on gas".

They use HOnda Civics and Camry's as examples of cheaper fuel-efficiant cars.

I don't feel the prius is in the same CLASS as the Camry or Civic. I think it's more along the lines of high-end luxury cars, when it comes to outfit...

and when people are saying you pay "MORE" for a Prius, i also find that irritating.
Most of the cars I considered were far MORE expensive. Acura & Infiniti...

The car I'm trading in was also the same price, if not more; a honda CRV....

I think the media needs to re-align where they percieve the target-market for this vehicle as being...

Who here drove CIVIC's or cheaper cars before getting a Prius? WHo here drove more expensive cars like INfiniti's or Acuras?

My bet is that many of us have come from a more premium brand of automobile....
 

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Civic, maybe but the Camry is the same size and that's where it's to our advantange. The old Prius was compared to the Corolla both in size and performance and that's probably close. With the new one, you're getting Camry size and equipment (more or less) for the same price as the old one and that has shruken the gap between the prices of the Prius and its "comparable" Toyota stablemate.


I don't feel like I'm paying more than what it's worth (other than the fact that Canadian Toyota dealers get a $4,000 profit as their invoice price is $4,000 below MSRP). Our family car is an 02 Camry XLE loaded with leather, moonroof, power front seats etc. While the Camry is softer riding and much wider, the Prius has its own merits; certainly when it comes to emissions and fuel efficiency. I pump half as much and go twice as far as my dad in his Camry. Ironically, my dad chose the car for me (after I chose the last 2 family cars) and frankly, I'm not disappointed. It's great fun (in terms of the mileage game), comfortable, high tech and cool.
 

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I have to disagree.

I traded up from a Hyundai Accent. A car that was $8000 when I purchased it new in 1999. Our other vehicle is a 1994 Ford Explorer, bought for $10,000 in 2000. (We still have both, but now the Explorer rarely gets driven.)

As alternatives to the Prius, we were considering a Hyundai Elantra GT ($15,000,) and a Volkwagen Jetta TDI ($18,000.) Or even a used 'Classic' Prius (In the neighborhood of $15,000.) My wife had previously owned a Nissan Maxima, an Acura, and an Infiniti, but all were used when she bought them; and she was married to someone who was a 'car nut' at the time. (From what she says, he ex would only buy cars that were at least 5 years old.) Oh, and my wife says the Prius compares favorably in performance to her old V6 Maxima.

if it hadn't been for the Prius, we wouldn't have even CONSIDERED a vehicle in this price class. So, yes, we did pay 'extra' for a hybrid. Our most likely 'second pick' would have been the Hyundai Elantra GT; so in the end, we ended up paying almost DOUBLE for the pleasure of a hybrid. (And we didn't even get the leather or sunroof we really wanted.) But, would I go back and trade cars? Not a chance.

I figure that we have saved over $700 in gas so far. And updating the spreadsheet I created to map out the cost difference (updating to account for actual miles driven, and the current cost of gas,) it looks like the Prius will end up being 'cheaper' to have owned in around 10 years. This takes into account gas cost, insurance cost (the cheaper Hyundai oddly would have cost us more in insurance,) and maintenance (we bought the maintenance/extended warranty for the Toyota, we wouldn't have for the Hyundai.)
 

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Re: irritated by media mis-comparing prius to inferior vehic

idealflaw said:
I am tired of reading articles claiming that "you pay more for the hybrid technology than you save on gas".

They use HOnda Civics and Camry's as examples of cheaper fuel-efficiant cars.

I don't feel the prius is in the same CLASS as the Camry or Civic. I think it's more along the lines of high-end luxury cars, when it comes to outfit...

and when people are saying you pay "MORE" for a Prius, i also find that irritating.
Most of the cars I considered were far MORE expensive. Acura & Infiniti...

The car I'm trading in was also the same price, if not more; a honda CRV....

I think the media needs to re-align where they percieve the target-market for this vehicle as being...

Who here drove CIVIC's or cheaper cars before getting a Prius? WHo here drove more expensive cars like INfiniti's or Acuras?

My bet is that many of us have come from a more premium brand of automobile....

Agree with you 100%! I have a BMW 7 Series and a GM SUV. I would have never considered a car like a Huyndai as I really think they are junk and they pollute worse than an SUV. Anyone should take a look at the EPA website on how dirty most of the Huyndais are. I was thinking about a used BMW Z3 or Z4 when I bought my used '02 Prius. So, I look that I saved money on the Prius. I only paid $16K three months ago for the car and it had only 7,100 miles on it. Couple that with the fact that I get over 50 mpg and I think I am saving big time on the hybrid.
 

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I agree that most comparisons I've seen are a bit simplistic and skewed to help make the writers point. However in all fairness I must admit I did trade in a better equipped less expensive car for my Prius. I honestly believe that what makes the Prius a bargain are things most automotive experts don't compare. I can't remember the last time I saw a car magazine discuss the geopolitical ramifications of choosing car x over y in one of their comparisons.
 

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Too simplistic

The articles I read before buying a Prius were very simplistic. "Conventional wisdom" was that the payback (what you save in gas vs. the extra cost of a hybrid) was ten years. When the article laid out how that figure was arrived at (which was rare), it would be similar to this 2004 article which stated (I'm paraphrasing): "At 12,000 miles per year, it will take a decade to pay back the extra cost in gas savings, at today's gas prices."

At today's gas prices? Geez, who in their right mind expects gas to stay at the same price for ten years? Look what's happened in 2005 alone!

And the above poster is right on in pointing out that none of these articles considers the larger political and environmental picture.

Americans in general are extremely shortsighted, looking for an immediate, direct and individual payback for something that is long term, indirect and beneficial to society as a whole.

The issue is values. Many people appreciate luxury and status and are willing to pay top dollar for it in the form of a BMW, Mercedes or Jaguar. No one expects this luxury to somehow "pay for itself." Buying a fuel efficient, low polluting car is a value to me. Getting some, all, or more than all of the cost back in gas savings is a bonus.


Jan
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
interesting posts! I'm not exactly sure what went into my own motivation for purchasing a prius, myself.

i knew it was time for a new car, for one.
MPG is really important to me. I drive A LOT. 83k on my 02 CR-V.

i suppose the cost savings, environmental benefits initally drew me to this car. the test drive sold me though.

For example: i can sit in the car with the AC on without turning on the gas.
That is HUGE. I can't tell you how many times i've pulled into a parking lot to take a quick nap in between customer appointments. I used to leave the car running and feel guilty about burning gas and my wallet...

The design was a big selling point as well.. it was big enough to fit a surfboard, lumber, or my 2 dogs, luggage and a 3rd passenger to boot.... that isn't a huge compromise to me...

I looked at the Toyota Highlander Hybrid but the price was too steep... I genuinely think that gas prices are just going to explode and mess up the economy (for at least the next 3 years) so I'd rather just save the $ now....
 

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NBC really seems to have it out for the Prius. The tone of their coverage is already the subject of a thread over at PriusChat and I've experienced it myself since buying our Prius last month.

A coworker recently asked me about a story he'd just seen on NBC Nightly News about emergency workers facing electrical shock hazards while rescuing crash victims from Prii. We immediately Googled the topic and found that Toyota had issued a press release following an erroneous AP story about this and AP retracted their story...last year! NBC apparently missed that part.

Just last week, NBC ran another piece arguing that hybrid owners are all victims of hype because their cars supposedly don't get the promised gas mileage and lose resale value quickly. As negative as this piece was, they still reluctantly conceded that the Prius is the one hybrid whose additional cost does, in fact, pay for itself (in 5 years according to the story). Naturally, they didn't provide any of the assumptions on which their conclusions were based, nor did they explain how they determined the "additional cost" of the Prius, since there is no non-hybrid version of the car.

Just yesterday, our local paper's "Auto Weekly" section carried a story from the Washington Post titled, "Spectra SX: A sensible alternative to the hybrid". Yeah, right. I'm sure this couldn't be the oil industry trying to create FUD by planting stories like this to be spread by their surrogates in the major media. Still, I wouldn't be surprised if the Petroleum Institute started airing spots for a new "public service" campaign this year..."Just say NO to energy-efficient vehicles".

Regards,
Harry
 

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I can prove to you that based on cost per calorie, a Snickers bar is a much better deal than spinach. Why would anyone buy spinach when they could have Snickers? People can play with statistics to "prove" what ever point they want to make.
 

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Hep said:
I can prove to you that based on cost per calorie, a Snickers bar is a much better deal than spinach. Why would anyone buy spinach when they could have Snickers? People can play with statistics to "prove" what ever point they want to make.
Great analogy, Hep. Just ask us teachers when test scores are analyzed.
 

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Re: irritated by media mis-comparing prius to inferior vehic

idealflaw said:
I don't feel the prius is in the same CLASS as the Camry or Civic. I think it's more along the lines of high-end luxury cars, when it comes to outfit...
Pricewise, the Prius competes with entry level luxury cars, such as the A4 and S40. Materials wise, the Prius competes with Hyundais and low end Chevys. You'll *never* find any luxury car with the loads of hard plastic and only 2 way adjustable seats that the Prius has.
 

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Any cost comparison must include not only operting cost and purchase price, but also resale value. Consumers Union rated the Prius a best buy because of its phenomenal resale value. The cost per year, including depreciation (or lack of it), made the Prius pay off.
 

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Re: irritated by media mis-comparing prius to inferior vehic

Jonnycat26 said:
Pricewise, the Prius competes with entry level luxury cars, such as the A4 and S40. Materials wise, the Prius competes with Hyundais and low end Chevys. You'll *never* find any luxury car with the loads of hard plastic and only 2 way adjustable seats that the Prius has.
I agree with the price half, but not with the materials half. I own a Hyundai, and the Prius is light years ahead of the Hyundai for its interior. Not to knock the Hyundai (I actually do like it,) but the Prius is way better. Better seat fabric, better plastic, and better seats. (Although it is odd that it's missing lumbar; but I find myself *NOT* missing the lumbar.)
 

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Re: irritated by media mis-comparing prius to inferior vehic

Jonnycat26 said:
idealflaw said:
I don't feel the prius is in the same CLASS as the Camry or Civic. I think it's more along the lines of high-end luxury cars, when it comes to outfit...
Pricewise, the Prius competes with entry level luxury cars, such as the A4 and S40. Materials wise, the Prius competes with Hyundais and low end Chevys. You'll *never* find any luxury car with the loads of hard plastic and only 2 way adjustable seats that the Prius has.
I'll have to disagree with you on the pricewise comparision. I drive an A4 and looked at getting an A4 or A3.

The Prius base is $21k, fully equipped is arond $28k. A base A4 is $27k. You can't add nav or bluetooth as options, so you're stuck with the base package. You have to go with the 3.2L V6 Quattro model to get the premium package. The base on the 3.2 is $35k and the options add another $3k to total $38k.

A better comparision is the A3. Base is $27k, fully featured is around $33k. That's what I was going to get :).

If you want to compare against Audi, compare against the VW. The Jetta or Passat are in the same price range. A 2.0T Passat with nav runs $29k.

I'm not as familiar with the Volvo but the same thing. Yu'd want to go S40 T5 edition. It has CVT. With Xenon lights, nav, traction control you're looking at $32k basically.

Personally the Prius is not good enough to be a luxury sports sedan which is what the Audi/Volvo lines are. It's not going to compare against any of the european cars available in the US for price (except for VW). It's also hybrid which none of the european cars can do. If any of them had a hybrid system available, I'd buy it.

It's a GREAT midsize car and a great value for that. That's why I'm buying one.
 

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Re: irritated by media mis-comparing prius to inferior vehic

ehurtley said:
I agree with the price half, but not with the materials half. I own a Hyundai, and the Prius is light years ahead of the Hyundai for its interior. Not to knock the Hyundai (I actually do like it,) but the Prius is way better. Better seat fabric, better plastic, and better seats. (Although it is odd that it's missing lumbar; but I find myself *NOT* missing the lumbar.)
What year is your Hyundai? I've been in recent model year Hyundais, and they include this stuff called "soft touch plastic" which was apprently unknown to the engineers of the Prius. The Prius ranks somewhere around my '87 cavalier in terms of interior design and comfort.
 

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Wow Johnny, high praise for a Cavalier. Well, I suppose it is all subjective, but I have a mid-80s Mercury that is still in my garage and frankly the Merc can't hold a candle to the Prius, however the Mercury beats a Cavalier any day of the week.
 

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Jonny, the new 06 will have the soft-touch plastic. Is that okay? :(
 

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Re: irritated by media mis-comparing prius to inferior vehic

idealflaw said:
I am tired of reading articles claiming that "you pay more for the hybrid technology than you save on gas".
Me too.
I don't feel the prius is in the same CLASS as the Camry or Civic. I think it's more along the lines of high-end luxury cars, when it comes to outfit...
Agreed. I have owned 35 cars, and this is the first one I feel is like a luxury car. Of course, I did get package number 6...

Who here drove CIVIC's or cheaper cars before getting a Prius?
I drove a SCION xB. Now, it was cheaper when I bought it, for sure, but after I tricked it out...it was closer to the fully loaded price of the Prius.

I am glad I did trade it. Yesterday, someone offered me full price, if I would sell the Prius to him. I told him no. That was a first.
 

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Hep said:
I can prove to you that based on cost per calorie, a Snickers bar is a much better deal than spinach. Why would anyone buy spinach when they could have Snickers? People can play with statistics to "prove" what ever point they want to make.
My gosh, that was funny...I really did laugh.

99% of statistics are 48% wrong.
 

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this topic really touches a nerve with me. Car and Driver compares the Prius to the Corolla on their rants. The question should be: At what pricepoint can you get a car that has nav system, smartkey entry, bluetooth, stability control, side curtain airbags, HID headlamps, etc. Answer: alot higher than the $27k that a Prius costs! Plain and simple, a fully equiped Prius is a bargain. The hybrid system is gravy. Mmmmm . . gravy . . . .
 
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