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kenlacy said:
However, you would cut back on a lot more emmissions if you would get everyone to dump their riding or push lawn mowers and go back to pushing around a some spinning blades.
Bought a Neuton cordless electric lawnmower about 10 months before getting the Prius. It cuts our our entire moderately-sized tree-shaded yard on a single charge. For technical details go to http://www.countryhomeproducts.com/ and click on the "Neuton Cordless" button.
 

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melgish said:
Doesn't that depend on your definition of efficiency? Your scooter might get you to the store, but will it efficiently carry home your groceries?
I can efficiently carry two full plastic bags of groceries on the hook below the handlebars, an additional small bag below the seat. If I bungie cord a milk crate to the cargo rack, I can carry three more bags in that (although I rarely do that). If I need more than that I take the car. If I need 1200lbs of mulch, I take my truck.

Most of my trips require the movement of me and a small handful of cargo. Say a thermos of coffee, a bagle, and my lunch. And for that my scoot is ideal.

If I could only have one? A Prius would be my first choice. But its nice to have options.
 

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clshep said:
I see; so you’re estimating that the H2 will burn more fuel than other V8’s and V10’s because…..it’s heavier than these other vehicles?

Just trying to make sense of your theory that the H2 is a gas guzzling equivalent of an alcoholic and his vodka. :shock: There are a lot of vehicles on the road that suck gas just as fast if not worse than an H2.

The Dodge Ram 1500, Chevy SSR, Silverado, Toyota Tundra, Escalade, Tahoe, Suburban, Yukon, even the Nissan Armada sucks gas just as bad as the H2 but I don’t see anyone complaining about these vehicles.

Shep
There are other cars out there the suck more than the H2. I HATE them all! The H2 is one of those cars that seems to take the hole thing to extreme. On the CNN website there was an article about a new truck that will dwarf the current leader in enormouse SUV's. They expect to sell 50 of these next year ... but the leader of extremely huge SUV's is the H2.

Am I being fair about my hatred of the H2? Probably not. From what I've read, you are a defensive driver and think about people around you. I admire that very much! We need more people like that. Here is something that happened to me because of someone who does not drive defensively. This would not have been as big a problem if a smaller car was infront of me:

I was driving on the freeway about 60 MPH. The H2 infront of me started to break, so I hit my break as well. At the last minute, the H2 makes a fast lane change to reveal to me a car infront of him that was doing about 20 MPH (at this point I was doing about 40). Luckily, I had left enough room to slow down before I hit this car. If the H2 had spent more time slowing down and less time trying to get out of the lane while maintaining as much speed as possible, there would have been no problem (he would have breaked harder and so would I). If the car infront of me had not been an SUV or truck, I would have seen the situation through the windows of the car in front of me.

This was not an isolated incodent, just the one that scared me the most. It has happend too many times with other SUV's (most of them were not H2's).

So between the poor gas millage and the large sizes, I hate all SUV's. The H2 tops the list because of my own pregidices (sp?).
 

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Large SUV's cause a very serious safety hazzard by blocking the view of other drivers. You can't see over them, through them, or arround them, and the less you know about what's on the road beyond the brick wall of a vehicle near you, the less safe you are.

An additional safety issue also arises from their size. Large SUV's barely fit into the lanes of many city streets, and when they are driven by people not properly trained to drive a vehicle of that size, they become a safety hazzard to everyone around them. You can take your driving test in a Civic and then get behind the wheel of an H2, and this is just plain dangerous.
 

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one of the great reasons to live in the us... freedom of choice. i love my prius. i like the porsche boxter and ferraris. hm2 just too ugly for me. i do not want them banned penalized or any other crud like that. just enjoy what you like and try to resist the urge to make others make the same choice as you. at least thats my feeling.
fred
 

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I can say that my Prius will be replacing an SUV (a Nissan Pathfinder to be exact) and I do have some reservations about that. I use the Pathfinder for numerous trips to Home Depot etc. and have had to think very carefully about how to deal with switching to a car that is even more limited in hauling stuff. It's not as if I can get a 4x8 piece of Sheetrock into the Pathfinder but I ain't going strap a bunch to the top of the Prius.

Recently, however, my wife has, due to our impeding increase in family size, suggested we look into minivans :shock: I was incredulous until I saw that you can load Sheetrock INSIDE some models. Hmm.

Anyway, I purchase my SUV on the very early upswing of the craze and, frankly, I'm never too happy when I somehow end up enmeshed in part of a popular fad. And I do have negative feelings towards the super-sized SUVs like the Suburban, Excursion, Armada, etc.; the Hummers stand out only in terms of their styling which I definitely don't care for. And I have found that many SUV owners buy them with misguided beliefs about their safety. It is sort of like having a gun solely for home protection (I realize I'm opening a can of worms with this analogy): the theory of increased safety isn't borne out in practice, especially from a general public health standpoint. What also amuses/irritates me are unrealistic/imaginary plans for their use. My favorite was my unattached female friend who bought one partially with the expection being a soccer Mom in the distant future.

And Ken Lacy, I know you don't fall into the category of illogical SUV owner :)

Still not sure about the minivan thing though...
 

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Fred: Freedom of choice is one thing. Permitting people to drive oversized vehicles without the proper training is something else altogether.
 

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oh, daniel its good to hear your voice again. ive just rejoined the group and yours is always one of voices i like to listen to. i agree with you but... thats true of any vehicle including prius, sportscars, truck , motorcycles etc. im not arguing that you are not right,b ut theoretically they do have a license to operate that :) t vehicle based on training and passing a test. iknow, i know in reality its a joke but there will never be a special license test for suvs or sportscars or even prius. i did have to take a wonderful course and pass a test for my harley motorcycle license.
your pal , fred.
 

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I got my Seaside Pearl ,pkg #9,last month and am still amazed at this car .I drove a Toyota T100 for years (it's still running good at 261,000),said I would never buy another passenger car ,but I did.Someone reneged on their order ,so I bought it off the lot real quick.
Averaging allmost 50 mpg.Everybody on this forum gripes about the price ,but I drive 4000 miles a month .My gas bill was outrageous.I traded in a Rav4 that was being garaged and now the saved $ from gas almost pays for the note.
The other day I didn't realize I was going 80 and the car felt like it was going 20.( no shakes ,rattles,etc.)
The nav system is incredible .
I'm sold !!
the first week I had a rock or bolt hit the hood above the headlight and put a dig in the paint .I would suggest getting a front end bra!
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
I think this is the truck that was metnioned earlier in the thread.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6026041/

Truck maker unveils a monster pickup
Navistar's 14,500-pound vehicle gets 7 miles a gallon

"Anybody can lease a Hummer now for $500 a month. Soccer moms are driving them," he said. "This is not a soccer mom's vehicle."
 

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Thanks, CLShep, for your posts. I confess, I have no warm spot in my heart for SUVs in general, and especially for the Hummers, due to problems with obstruction of vision for other drivers and the poor gas mileage mentioned. But I very much appreciate your reasoned and polite posts, and I also recognize my prejudices on the matter. Just because I'm not a person who needs to tow a boat, horse trailer, etc. doesn't mean I should want to stop someone else for enjoying those things. A big part of my gripe with them is the people here in the Bay Area who drive them because it's a cool status thing (especially those darn Cadillac Escalades)- again, my prejudice, but I'm guessing a good # of the drivers never take them off road, and don't have any real reason to need a car that big. If I'm just going skiing in Tahoe, I can throw my gear on the rack on our Honda Civic or Saturn Sedan.

I was quite surprised by the gas mileage info you posted. Guess my question is whether there are other trucks/SUVs on the market that get better gas mileage that would serve your needs as well as the H2?

The bigger question for all of us is the bigger picture: how we choose to use resources. I'm not buying a Prius just to save gas, but also because of the lower emissions. It's not perfect, but it's one of the best things on the market right. And I'm not just doing it for myself - I want to do what I can to leave the world in better shape when I'm gone. Think we all know (hopefully) that those of us in the U.S. use a disproportionately large share of the world's resources. It doesn't to be that way, and IMO,we owe it those who come after us to not squander limited natural resources if we don't have to. (& BTW in response to the lawn mower comment earlier, yes, we do use a push mower. Or I should say we did- the lawn is on the way out, and is being converted to low water perennial beds on drip irrigation. We really do try to walk the talk.)

OK, I'm gettin' off the soap box now. And about that Prius - we've been waiting almost 9 months now javascript:emoticon(':(') for a blue one -hope it shows up soon.
 

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This is another of those subjects where it will be impossible to change anyones opinion. For anything to happen it will have to be done by Government administration. Most Hummer and "H2" purchasers buy them because they are "different" just as do a good portion of Prius purchasers. Alot of people (because of gov't tests) believe they are in much safer vehicles when they are in a SUV. Very few actually use the four wheel drive. In fact a good portion sold are FWD only. Whether they are safer now with the common use of air-bags I can't say. They are certainly more subject to "rollovers" But it's whatever pleases. As far as the "Escalades" these are just Cadilac owners who appreciate quaility and still want what they believe is the added safety of a SUV. Ditto those who choose the LIncoln Navigator. You can't blame General Motors or Ford for supplying this demand. Same reason for the Mercedes, Lexas and Infinities. They do "suck" a lot of gas and maybe five dollars a gallon would help. At least "cut back" Only trouble here is it would also raise the price for oil used in industry and for home heating oil. I think the Europeans and Australians have it figured out correctly with two dollars a gallon taxes, price of oil be damned.
 

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zinzindorff9 said:
Very few actually use the four wheel drive. In fact a good portion sold are FWD only.
I like to piss off the owners of those faux suvs by calling them vans or station wagons. In my mind without four wheel drive, thats what it is, a tall station wagon or squared off van. They hate this.
 

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Daniel, that's a little over the top...

While technically accurate using this logic you would make more sense ranting about a hatred of semi's on the roads. They are far bigger than any SUV and there are far, far more of them than any H2's.

Should we ban semi trucks from our highways due to safety concerns?

Of course not.

When you drive in and around trucks while on the highway you naturally use more caution. No different than SUV's. They are here to stay for the forseeable future. Just use extra caution when you're around them, just like you would any other large vehicle on the road.

Daniel said:
Large SUV's cause a very serious safety hazzard by blocking the view of other drivers. You can't see over them, through them, or arround them, and the less you know about what's on the road beyond the brick wall of a vehicle near you, the less safe you are.

An additional safety issue also arises from their size. Large SUV's barely fit into the lanes of many city streets, and when they are driven by people not properly trained to drive a vehicle of that size, they become a safety hazzard to everyone around them. You can take your driving test in a Civic and then get behind the wheel of an H2, and this is just plain dangerous.
 

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suv's

I can appreciate all the comments that people make about these silly vehicles. In an urban setting their practicality is suspect. But if I lived in some parts of Canada I wouldn't hesitate to own one.

In the meantime you'll recognize me if you see me. I'm the guy with the stupid grin on his face at the gas pump on the occasional time that the Prius needs to take a drink! :lol:
 
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