Would you buy an electric vehicle? - Page 3 - Toyota Prius Forum : Prius Online Toyota Forums
View Poll Results: Would you buy an electric vehicle?
Yes 16 48.48%
Maybe 15 45.45%
No 2 6.06%
Voters: 33. You may not vote on this poll

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post #21 of 35 (permalink) Old 02-24-2008, 03:19 PM Thread Starter
 
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Default Re: Would you buy an electric vehicle?

A electric car is still cleaner than a gas powered car. On the average 50% of the electricity is generated in the U.S. by coal fired plants.
If you wish you can check out the technical information supporting this conclusion.

http://www.pluginamerica.org/images/...onsSummary.pdf
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post #22 of 35 (permalink) Old 02-24-2008, 04:52 PM
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Default Re: Would you buy an electric vehicle?

And wgy not? We have the largest supply of coal in the world. Clean the burning of it and we could eliminate all our importation of foreign oil.



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post #23 of 35 (permalink) Old 02-29-2008, 10:01 PM
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Default Re: Depends where the electric comes from

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frizzycat666
I
live just outside Sacramento CA and the utility actually allowed the public to vote to take our perfectly good atomic plant offline. Nowadays we get electric from coal and jet engines that burn natural gas we even have a few diesel generators for summer time. so for me an electric would be a bad joke.. better for the environment for me to drive a diesel Hum-Vee with a slight oil leak.
I was going to write about how coal-powered electricity is still cleaner than a Prius... Then I did research.

Coal produces 2.3 lbs of CO2 per KWh of electricity generated. Gasoline contains 37 KWh of energy per gallon, and produces 19.5 pounds of CO2 per gallon burned.

That means that one gallon of gas produces 37 KWh of energy and releases 19.5 pounds of CO2. Yet to generate the same 37 KWh of energy by coal releases 85.1 pounds of CO2. And the transfer to batteries reduces efficiencies. Wow. Yet I see plenty of sources that claim that even coal-powered electric cars would be cleaner than gas. Of course, none of this takes lifecycle costs into account. It could be possible that total lifecycle environmental costs for an electric car would be better than for a gas-powered car.

Of course, if you slap solar panels or windmills up on your property, and recharge your car from that, voila, instant clean car. (Again, not taking total lifecycle costs into account, though.)

Owner of 'Eeyore', a 2004 Prius. Only took 2 days from start of search to delivery.

8 years of ownership, 115,000 miles, about 40 MPG average at present.
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post #24 of 35 (permalink) Old 03-02-2008, 02:55 PM Thread Starter
 
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Default Re: Would you buy an electric vehicle?

Most power companies get on the average of 50% of thier power from coal. So it all depends on the sources of the energy.

Get ready for a little math.

The power company for Sacramento is SMUD. SMUD gets 95% of its power from PG&E.
On PG&E website is a carbon footprint calculator. Using this calculator I found that for every kwh of electricity that PG&E produces makes 0.524 lb of CO2.
0.524 lb x 37kwh = 19.39 lb of CO2. But wait a second doing the calculations is not this simple. This is because the distances the car travels on a unit energy is different between the two types of vehicles.
We know that Prius can go at least 50 miles on a gallon of gas, and release 19.5 lb of CO2 in to the air. We know that for PG&E it produces 0.524 lb of CO2 for every kilowatt of electricity produced. We will use the Tesla electric car as an example. The Tesla uses a 56 kwh battery pack, and can travel 220 miles on a single charge. Now we will find the energy used per mile. 56 kwh / 220 miles = 0.254 kwh/mile. To travel 50 miles it will take 12.727 Kwh of energy to travel the distance. Now lets calculate the charging energy. 12.727 kwh / 0.8 efficiancy = 15.909 kwh. 15.909 kwh x 0.524 lb = 8.336 lb of CO2 produced.
This is a 57% reduction in CO2.
The Prius is a great car. I know because I drive one every day.
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post #25 of 35 (permalink) Old 04-24-2008, 02:21 AM
 
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Default Re: Would you buy an electric vehicle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hyperion
And wgy not? We have the largest supply of coal in the world. Clean the burning of it and we could eliminate all our importation of foreign oil.
Better let, some overeducated fool has come out with the bright idea that we just need to turn the smoke stacks upside down. So the carbon will go back into the earth,,,,,,,,,,

ok, well I'm out learning Aribic,,,,,
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post #26 of 35 (permalink) Old 05-23-2008, 09:31 PM
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Default Re: Would you buy an electric vehicle?

yes.


But need to get better than 50 warm weather, more like 100 to 150 and
able to run at 55 short term.

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post #27 of 35 (permalink) Old 05-24-2008, 09:42 AM
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Default Re: Would you buy an electric vehicle?

Obviously we can not supply the reliance on oil problem in this country (except to plan!) so I say, bring on the "electrics."
Preferably American!
So I hope industry pitches in and solves the battery problem "sooner" than "later"



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post #28 of 35 (permalink) Old 05-24-2008, 02:43 PM Thread Starter
 
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Default Re: Would you buy an electric vehicle?

Actually their are batteries that will work right now. The Nickel metal hydrate battery that is used in all currently mass produced hybrids. The pattent was owened by Ovionic. When GM was producing the EV1 they bought 60% share in Ovionic. Once they stop producing the EV1 GM sold their controling stock. Chevron Texaco bought the controling stock in Ovionics. With control of the company Chevron Texaco refused to lience the large format batteries to any other company. The largest battery that was allowed to be made was a 10 amp hour size. They then sued Panasonic who was also making the large format batteries. Under terms of the settlement Panasonic would not manufacture these large format batteries that were used in the Rav4 EV until 2010. The battery division was then spun off as seperate new company.
Then there are the lithium batteries. These do not have long track history, but some of the new battery formuals do look very promissing. Toyota thankfull is still playing with a plug in version of the Prius. This is good because it could lead to full electric car further down the road.
Interest in a full electric car is being pushed by $4 plus gas prices.

Multiple manufactures will be making EV's in the year 2010.
Most auto manufactures are doing research into electric vehicles

Manufactures with active EV programs
GM
FORD
Mitsubishi
Subaru
Toyota?
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post #29 of 35 (permalink) Old 05-29-2008, 12:44 PM
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Default Re: Would you buy an electric vehicle?

Watched the "special" on hybrids and electrics monday night on the national news. Seems the four dollar gas just might be the "shove" the industry is needing to get really serious. GM now has several companies working 24/7 on the batteries and now plan a 09 rollout for "Volt" production and an 80 cent six hour "charge" for forty miles of driving before the "in car" generator has to run. (Still aiming for under $30,000 MSRP)
Plug-in Prius just might be a year earlier account of this competition.



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post #30 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-02-2009, 05:09 PM
 
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Default Re: Would you buy an electric vehicle?

What is often ignored is that Toyota had an all electric RAV4, which has a range of 150 miles and a top speed of 90mph. Nobody talked about it, nobody bought them. Toyota stopped production.

Now only So Cal Edison and some collectors own them (50k street price). I was going to buy a used one from Edison for $8k, but the sales lady talked me out of it. Edison still has a lot of them in San Dimas.

Also, Jet Industries bought many Ford Courier Pickup truck sans drivetrain. Installed wet cell battery packs and electric motors. Top speed of 70 mph and 50 mile range..this was in 1989. Yet Ford claims they cannot make an electric car. Some of these are still in government service. So the government knew about them too.

I can convert your VW rabbit, BMW325, small pickup to Electric for $8k including batteries, not including labor ($3-4k). 100k miles on the motor. No engine, no radiator, no fuel tank, etc etc.
Need a new battery pack every 3 or 4 years at $2k, but how much did you save on gas after you pay minimally for electricity.
Maintenance: Monthly check battery fluid level, brakes tires, every three years new batteries, 100k miles replace brushes in motor (like changeing a spark plug).
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