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Automatic Headlight Leveling Trouble

47K views 38 replies 10 participants last post by  DanMan32 
#1 ·
My 2005 Prius orange warning triangle comes on and remains on for a few miles. The display indicates trouble with automatic headlight leveling. At 38,000 miles, the dealer wants about $500.00 repair. Is it possible to repair/replace the sensor myself? If so, how do I find a manual with instructions?

Thanks, Dale.
 
#3 ·
KTPhil said:
It's a known problem and should be covered under warrantee.
That is if you bought extended warrantee. If not, you can shop the repair elsewhere. Anyone who works on Prius will know what to do, as KTPhil points out, it happens enough to be familiar on this forum.
 
#4 ·
Tell them that your headlight aim has been bad for the last couple of months (i.e., prior to 36K miles), with people flashing their lights as you approach them, and only now do you get a dash warning. This way you had the problem during the warranteee period.

True, it's a TSB, not a recall, but they obviously know the units are failing at higher than normal rates, and there was a systematic defect, not a random failure. Make noise and they will probably do the right thing.

Print the TSB and show it to them. If you appear to have the evidence together, they will probably figure you will make noise and decide to fix it to avoid the hassle.

Notice there is a revised part. Obviously the old ones had a problem they know about!

4/28/2006 - 2004 – 2005 model year Toyota Prius vehicles equipped with an Automatic Headlight Leveling System.

Some Prius vehicles, equipped with High-Intensity Discharge (HID) headlamps and an Automatic Leveling Light system, may experience a Master Warning Light and Automatic Headlight Leveling System Warning Light “ON” or flashing at times. An improved rear vehicle height control sensor has been introduced to correct this condition.


http://www.alldata.com/tsb/Toyota/1146207600000_1147676400000_EL004-06/41.html

http://www.alldata.com/tsb/Toyota/1146207600000_1147676400000_EL004-06/42.html
 
#8 ·
The common defect is in the sensor assembly, so the replacement should not involve getting at the ECM. Several here have done this process when they removed, and cleaned, their original sensor. I think the posts/photos are gone in a previous server meltdown, but someone had posted photos of the innards and how to clean and repair it. This is an option if Toyota does a brain fart and refused to replace an obviously defectively designed/made part.
 
#9 ·
You don't have to get to the ECM to perform the headlight leveling initialization. You only have to ground out pin 8 on the DLC and flash the headlights 3 or so times within 20 seconds. And that's only if the warning remains after the level sensor is replaced, and the car leveled with 10 gallons in the tank, no cargo or people in the car.

Adjusting the headlamp level will be more of a pain though.
 
#10 ·
I beg pardon! A very simple operation! Of course the service manual starts by disconnecting the battery and hence the ECM procedure.
Maybe a quote from several dealers. You might just find an honest one who keeps actual track of his labor cost. Reading the procedure in the manual sort of indicates the $500.00 to be an honest charge.
Now as to the part being "mickey mouse" and easily subject to failure, it is a bit more of a reason for the extended warranty if the car is to be kept long.
 
#11 ·
The sensor:





Remove the sensor, then remove the four cover screws to expose the electrical sensor, which can get wet and corrode. You might be able to fix your old one by cleaning it up inside. First check if it is hooked up (mechanically and electrically); you might just have a loose wire.
 
#12 ·
Hyp, I suggest you re-read page 5-1675 (1839). No mention of disconnecting any batteries.

I grant you that for just about any electrical proceedure the manual states to disconnect the 12V battery, but for most of them the manual is overcautious, and that would certainly include the replacement of the sensor. I don't think there's any voltage at the sensor when the car's power is off. All 3 leads go straight to the headlight beam leveler ECM, so you can't even blow any fuses.
 
#13 ·
hyperion said:
Now as to the part being "mickey mouse" and easily subject to failure, it is a bit more of a reason for the extended warranty if the car is to be kept long.
There you go with the extended warranty thing again. Just because something is "easily subject to failure" doesn't mean that it will happen to most people. There is a lot of ground between never and always. Every car has things that can break on it. I think it is sill to mention every failure as reason for an extended warranty. We've been over it before. Insurance is generally a losing bet and its value to an individual relates to their own financial situation. People don't buy insurance to make money. They buy it to insulate themselves from large losses, generally accepting the fact that they will take a more manageable loss to do so.
 
#15 ·
hyperion said:
And as we left it many times before, "to each, their own." They certainly would eliminate a lot of questions being asked here!
I don't think they would eliminate any questions. Most questions relate to what is causing a problem, regardless of whether or not it will be fixed under warranty. I agree with the "to each, their own" philosophy. I would just like not to see the extended warranty brought up every time someone says they are having a problem since anecdotal occurrences don't prove anything at all. For instance, it is now 35 degrees outside here in San Jose at 6:45 PM. I don't ever remember it being that cold this early in the evening but I don't think it indicates that the world is cooling off.
 
#16 ·
redwein said:
hyperion said:
And as we left it many times before, "to each, their own." They certainly would eliminate a lot of questions being asked here!
I don't think they would eliminate any questions. Most questions relate to what is causing a problem, regardless of whether or not it will be fixed under warranty. I agree with the "to each, their own" philosophy. I would just like not to see the extended warranty brought up every time someone says they are having a problem since anecdotal occurrences don't prove anything at all. For instance, it is now 35 degrees outside here in San Jose at 6:45 PM. I don't ever remember it being that cold this early in the evening but I don't think it indicates that the world is cooling off.
redwein,

Are you the RothWine ? If you are, thanks for referring and coming along with : Dennis Pu , for his 07 Prius Epitome packaged purchase. It was very nice meeting you.
 
#18 ·
hyperion said:
And as we left it many times before, "to each, their own." They certainly would eliminate a lot of questions being asked here!
I don't think they would eliminate any questions. Most questions relate to what is causing a problem, regardless of whether or not it will be fixed under warranty. I agree with the "to each, their own" philosophy. I would just like not to see the extended warranty brought up every time someone says they are having a problem since anecdotal occurrences don't prove anything at all. For instance, it is now 35 degrees outside here in San Jose at 6:45 PM. I don't ever remember it being that cold this early in the evening but I don't think it indicates that the world is cooling off.
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.But you see, this is where we disagree completely. I just "passed" on any extended warranty for my wifes new Highlander because I understand about every componant on the car. Parts can be purchased for it at just about any auto supply store and any garage in the U.S. can diagnose any problems and fix them. (None of the above with a Prius.)
I've been tinkering on cars for the past sixty years and I wouldn't take the Prius off the Toyota lot if I planned on keeping it for over the three year or 36 mos warranty period without an extended warranty. Geez, $500 to just swap out a headlight leveling sensor!
I would even purchase on the first day of ownership just to be darn sure there would be a loaner car available every time the car was left for diagnosis. My opinion hasn't changed but has been enforced by the two year plus ownership and the more I have learned about the car. There is one thing to be able to "self insure" and another to have to worry about how long the car will be unavailable, whether parts will be available, and just what the heck it is going to cost.
The Prius just cannot be compared with any other type of automobile, And this five hundred charge for one sensor is a perfect example why the extended makes a lot of sense. This one item is one half the cost of the warranty.
(And it was 62 degrees one day here last week and the norm is 35.)
 
#19 ·
Do we have confirmation from another owner or another dealer that the correct price really is $500? I can see maybe $50-100 for the part (even that is generous), and it might take one hour for a tech with the manual. Give him double that. Let's be generous and say labor is $100/hour. So taking the high side of these high estimates, that's $100 parts plus $200 labor for a grand total of maybe $300. $500? Take it to another dealer, then call Toyota and report the dealer.
 
#20 ·
Hyperion, You seem to keep missing my point. The fact that one repair on one car costs half the cost of the warranty doesn't prove the point you keep trying to make. Even if it happened on hundereds of them. Remember, many of them could have failed in the standard warranty too. The warranty is a good "deal" if the average person will save money with it. No anecdotal analysis, or even reading the service manual, can possibly tell you that. On the other hand, the car and warranty companies have a lot of data and past analysis experience at their disposal and are in business to make money on the warranty.

Heck, if I had enough money to invest and the proper data, I would offer you and anybody else who wanted one an extended warranty. Since that isn't the case, but I can afford to replace the car many times over, I'll accept that they priced it to make money rather than lose money. Assuming that, on average, I should expect to save money by not buying the warranty, even for the Prius. I'll agree that having enough money to handle the losing side of things enables you to win in the long run. That is how casinos make money, even though they lose bets every day.

Keep in mind that I'm not telling anyone what to do. My arguments hold true for fire insurance as well. People don't buy it because they expect their house to burn down. They buy it because they can't afford the consequences if it does. Most people who buy fire insurance on their house will, in fact, lose money.

I completely understand that you think your analysis is correct and theirs isn't so I have no problem with you buying the warranty, or anyone else for that matter. I think it is based more on fear than factual data and that is ok too. Remember, to each their own. I would just like to stop seeing the anecdotal evidence extrapolated out incorrectly and being used to make general recommendation for others. Call it a pet peeve of mine.
 
#21 ·
maybe we can get this turned into a recall?

When the sensor fails, do the headlights sometimes or always end up being aimed all the way down resulting in severe reduction of headlight range? If so, it might be possible to get this escalated to become a recall by NHTSA since this could arguably be a safety issue.

They've done recalls on other cars relating to lighting in the past.
 
#22 ·
Redwein, my remarks concern ONLY the Prius. This is not the normal everyday type of car. Personally I believe Toyota made a mistake for themselves even offering an extended warranty for the Prius at $1600 MSRP. At that price I might have "balked" and just walked away from the car. But at the price of less than a thousand available at many places it is just worth that for resale value of the car alone after the usual factory warranty has expired.
I'm speaking of an asset for Prius ownership. Not for the value of extended warranties which I am normally not prone to purchase. Maybe I will change my opinion on this, once I find some knowledge that Toyota service is getting some understanding of the Prius. However the more I learn of the cars systems the more I see in the value of the extended warranties here.
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#23 ·
Hyperion, Maybe you are right about increasing its resale value. It sounds possible but I don't really know one way or the other. Do you have any data on that? If not, then it still seems like the same thing to me. It may feel like you should be able to charge more for your car because of it but a potential buyer may elect the less expensive one that doesn't have it. I'm sure a dealer trade will give you something but I'm guessing that it will be less than you paid for it. In that case, if you sold your car in less than 3 years/36,000 miles you would definitely lose money.

Also, others, like myself plan to keep the car through what would be the extended warranty period anyway, so an extended warranty's effect on resale value is meaningless. I know you think people are crazy to do that but they do, and you don't seem to factor that into your "analysis".

That leaves 2 groups of people who will be unaffected by the resale value aspect or be guaranteed to lose money on it. It just seems obvious to me that we see this differently. I see it in pure statistical and numeric terms. You try to do that, but instead let your emotions and fears based on the complexity of the service manual and anecdotal evidence of failures be interpreted as more compelling data than the actual numbers. Like I said, if I had to bet my money on your analysis or Toyota's and the warranty companies', I would bet on them since I think you have much less data to go on.
 
#24 ·
I believe it was posted that it can fail with the lights aimed either uip or down. Either one is a safety hazard, either to the driver or to oncoming cars. This is one reason I think Toyota should replace it free. They already admitted it was a defective design, and it is a safety hazard.

Do they really want the publicity that a $500 safety hazard common to their technological showpiece is not their concern mere months after the official warrantee is out?
 
#26 ·
Since the owner stated such after bringing the car to the dealer I expect it was dignosed and the service manager just went to the book advising the cost of the fix.
As far as the number of posts here we have to remember that their are several hundred thousand Prius owners driving their cars and maybe experiancing problems who have never heard of either of the prius sites. My opthalmologist is one of these.
To him, the Prius is like the V.W. he drove in college.
 
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